EEv4 Current Status (4.0.10) - So close yet so far

mram · February 12, 2019, 5:10pm

Now that the official EoL of EEv3 has arrived. I wanted to start a conversation on where EEv4 stands for most of us users. I personally feel that EEv4 is not yet ready for production. I have a couple of low priority sites moved but have stopped short of moving the important sites over to v4 while more bugs are ironed out. EEv3 is still working fine for now while I wait for v4 to mature. I would say Docker has been a big shock in the way things are done, but I am getting used to it. This post was written off the cuff and I am sure I missed some things and some fears might be needless.

Why is it not ready?

The update command needs to be fully functional.
Email outbound needs to work.
UFW firewall does not work.
Stability* The Docker renaming problem caused some grief and downtime. Fear of change on a future x.0 or x.1 release still has me wondering if a structure change will be pushed and break things.
Stability* Rebooting fears. Sometimes sites were not coming back up. A reboot needs to be 100%. If we are resorting to a reboot, taking the server completely down means we need to be sure they will all come back up.

*Some of the stability issues will solidify with time and comfort levels will increase, but that still puts v4 in testing status for me. This post is not a bash on EE. Yes, there are work arounds to most of the issues, but that is not the point. To be production ready means we only need to focus on admin tasks, not doing work arounds. I still prefer both v3 and v4 of EE to all the other options out there. Having just spun up a competing project yesterday to see if I should jump ship. EE still has the right direction, just a little further to go.

If you have specific bug, Please use GitHub issues. It is easier for the devs. https://github.com/EasyEngine/easyengine/issues

What are everyone else’s thoughts on v4 thus far?

jamesnimmo · February 13, 2019, 10:04am

Not being able to switch site types is an issue for me, i.e. not being able to enable cache on a wp site after it has been created; so used to being able to switch site types from v3

terencemilbourn · February 14, 2019, 11:43am

What seems to be wrong with EasyEngine is not so much the choice of technologies, but the “strategy” behind its setup. It seems to be just a side-project and without a paying or PRO version, the money simply won’t be there to support its growth and development to make it a viable, professional product.

Even with all the hassles and delays of the new V4 in the past, it’s just for the first time today I’ve actually begun thinking this project isn’t going so well, and kinda bumping along the bottom.

So I took a look at a competitor (SpinupWP – wonder if its the same one as you?), and frankly, I was astounded at how much better it is than EasyEngine.

I guess that’s what happens. Somebody leads and others follow, allowing them to stand on your shoulders. However, SpinupWP is sooooo much better and the cost is low, so its not a consideration – especially with their current -50% offer – I don’t feel like there’s any real point in hanging around.

I’ll keep an eye on EasyEngine, wish the guys well, and maybe I’ll be back someday (who knows?), but I feel I now need to review my choice of Server/Control panel.

Good luck guys. I wish you well.

cim · February 16, 2019, 9:56am

I, too, am leaving EE. I’ve decided to create my own docker-compose stack using official docker images and putting them all together. Instead of having a site per container, which can greatly eat ram and disk space, I will put them all in one container.

hk009 · February 22, 2019, 9:01pm

Leaving EE4 too. Using Centminmod and it is a total upgrade. Very active support and a solid product compare to EE4 that is really not production ready.

terencemilbourn · February 27, 2019, 1:10pm

Just so that you know, I’ve changed my mind about using EE, after using #SpinupWP and trying to get them to fix the scripts I found were broken, I wouldn’t recommend it. Even though you’re paying them for the privilege of using what is actually just hosted Laravel, they are making some very rooky hosting mistakes and have a very casual way of handling customer support. THeir SEO scripts are years out of date and don’t conform to what either WordPress or NginX recommends. Not what I expected at all.

purbeckpixels · February 27, 2019, 2:16pm

I’ve switched my main WordPress server to Webinoly… for now anyway. I’ll continue to keep an eye on EE4 development but the issues I’ve been having are a bit too worrying to have it powering one of my production servers. Right now it’s just too ‘heavy’ for my liking, whereas Webinoly is lightweight and uses far fewer resources - it’s what WordOps (still down) should be if WordOps ever gets going again. Give Webinoly a try if you want to try something different while the wrinkles in EE4 are ironed out.

cim · February 27, 2019, 9:39pm

I’ve finally got my stack up and running in production, takes way less resources than using the official WordPress image with its apache bloat.

The third site is the heaviest, when it was using the official WordPress image, it would balloon over 200mb in ram.

@purbeckpixels I am using Webinoly in my other server but will be converting them to my own stack soon after more testing.

purbeckpixels · February 27, 2019, 9:42pm

Will you be releasing it on GitHub? Would be nice to try an alternative that uses Docker.

cim · February 27, 2019, 10:02pm

Maybe, once I do more testing. Here’s a sample command to create a new wp site.

# op wp domain.tld run
e5d4edd50362e2f1dcde20e80c0ea9d5baa1b48aa854edf6583d5fde6843accd
Success: Generated 'wp-config.php' file.
Success: WordPress installed successfully.


WordPress username: llipmebary
WordPress password: 74lJoKumaRZ2ymc5xosbCS3w7H8EUUnKcdbZJLO8rKuEfYqS6e

Chip · March 2, 2019, 9:50am

Guys, you can just try WordOps. While they have issues with their site and everything, it is VASTLY improved version of EE3.xx. Works much better, has everything EE used to have and doesn’t use stupid Docker instances per site.
I stopped using EE the moment Docker was introduced as it was incompatible with most of the hosts I was using for side projects.
I really HATE the way the EE project is going but I guess all good things come to an end eventually.

Chip · March 2, 2019, 9:52am

WordOps is quite alive, you can check their Slack channel. Basically the domain got suspended by their registrar and they still can’t get it back. They just released an update a few days back that is working flawlessly.

purbeckpixels · March 2, 2019, 8:01pm

I’ll definitely give WordOps a try down the line, but I admit I was a little discouraged by the domain name issue - it just didn’t fill me with confidence that it had a future, although @virtubox’s involvement is a plus. I’ve migrated 20 sites to EE4 then to Webinoly in the space of about a month, and that’s enough migrating for now. My Webinoly server is purring along nicely.

cim · March 4, 2019, 2:36am

I’ve migrated out of Webinoly and into my own docker stack. EEv4 is great but it’s too bulky for my taste. My WP sites are idling at 10mb of ram and MariaDB is around 50mb.

Helmi · March 4, 2019, 9:37am

Hey, interesting approach with your own docker stack? I’m a big fan of docker and using it on some other projects. Why not share it and have a few interested people improve it together?

Helmi · March 4, 2019, 9:50am

Interesting to read that. I just noticed it’s made by Delicious Brains. I had my experience with them through their WP Migrate DB plugin which holds me off from instantly jumping on any boats they control. Though will be interesting to see how SpinupWP develops.

cim · March 4, 2019, 9:54am

Hi, thanks for your interest. It’s nowhere near ready for other people to use it yet, the main bash script has lots of bugs I’m working on.

Helmi · March 4, 2019, 10:01am

First of all: I’m a big fan of docker. I can imagine people having a hard time getting used to the changes involved by the nature of docker I think it’s totaly the right thing to switch to it.

Apart from that I’m also wondering how that Switch to EEv4 happened in the way it happened. I have to admit, I don’t have a deep insight into the project and what it means for the company behind from an outside perspective I’d say the switch overall was a bit unlucky. For a final release you’d expect to have at least the most important featureset onboard or otherwise put big warning letters on every public post that says stuff like “Be aware that this is a complete rewrite and we start off with a very limited featureset” naming all the important stuff missing like (s)ftp to single sites, editable sites, switching types etc.

In addition the reliability of the update script of course is a problem. It’s kind of the central tool that has to work reliably.

I can remember having read about funding problems for the project in the past and can only imagine that it’s hard to keep it up. That’s why I try to stay soft on the critics. I’m sure the guys behind this, especially @rahul286 are investing a lot of time and energy to try to keep this free and open source. I appreciate that but I also agree with what @terencemilbourn said. I wish there was a commercial model in addition. One that also is affordable for the smaller customers, probably enables some additional features or support but foremost opens the ability to put this project on a solid funding base. With all the other projects around I think there’s still a lot of potential for such a project.

I’ll definitely stay with EE as long as I can keep my sites running and i’m totally willing to work around some glitches if only in thanks for what the guys did for the community in the last years.

terencemilbourn · March 5, 2019, 11:23pm

I’ll take a look. Thanks for the heads up.

By the way, before I moved back to Scotland I lived 35 years in St Ives near Ringwood and think the stretch of coast along the Purbecks is some of the nicest in the country.

If Webinoly turns out to be at least half as nice, I’ve found a watch.

rahul286 · March 8, 2019, 9:11am

Hi All,

Rahul from EE team here.

First I agree v4 is not as smooth as expected. We aim to build things “that just works” and this is not the case this time.

I agree with @mram checklist. Especially stability aspect. We have slowed down release cycle also for now. Because we want to get 4.1 updates, when available, rolled out without an issue!

That being said - we have v4 on most of our sites.

I do not have ETA for coming features. But stability is what our #1 and can be said the only goal for now.

I see some people are interested in running things with docker-compose. You may try https://github.com/10up/wp-local-docker-v2 and https://github.com/10up/wp-local-docker which can help you in that.

The goal of EasyEngine project and team is to make your life easy. Not push EasyEngine software down your throat!

If we come across any projects like 10up’s or WordOps, we will continue to recommend them.